Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Watcher

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Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Watcher

Post by Dark_Humor » Thu Feb 19, 2009 8:38 pm

Devanue Di'axa
The Grand Watcher
Primary: Intellegence
Model: Pending...
Side: The Hallowed Order
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Back Story
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Skills
Twin Guardians - Teleportational Wards
As I channeled my energy into this single Gate, leading to the Valley of Spirits.
It ripped in half, sending a sharp pain threw my hands, but they both stood standing.
One lay Crimson, the other Indigo.
They were a very interesting creation, allowing one to go threw another.
Very useful for teleporting between one place to another.

- The Watcher summons a Indigo Portal next to himself, and a Crimson portal at a target point, allowing Allied units to teleport between the two. Lasts 25/30/35/40/45 seconds, 1200/1400/1600/1800/2000 range, and only 2/3/4/5/6 can be set.

Gate Guard - Set Summon
A Gate that led to the greatest creation ever made.
Nothing guarded this wonderful piece.
I wanted something to guard this, so I opened a Portal to the Dark Lands.
A powerful creature walked threw it, heavily armored, this will serve as the guard.

- The Watcher summons a Portal next to himself, summoning a Powerful Dark Knight, with 400/500/600/700/800 HP, 50/75/100/125/150 MP, 11-15/22-26/33-37/44-48/55-59 damage, 2/3/4/5/6 armor, and the ability "Epidemic," costing all the Dark Knight's mana, summoning 5 unclickable Beetles, which will run into the nearest enemy, exploding, dealing 2x the amount of mana the Dark Knight sacrificed, and each Beetle cannot attack the same target. The Knight cannot leave 600/700/800/900/1000 AoE of the Portal, and when ever an allied hero has 20% of its max life in a 1200/1400/1600/1800/2000 range of the Portal, they will instantly be teleported next to it, making the Knight sacrifice half its life, healing the teleported unit by 200/250/300/350/400 HP.

Library - AoE Massive Damage
There are two states, Reality, and Nothing.
Reality is for the Fools who have no creativity.
Nothing is for the Fools who have died.

- The Watcher instantly sends a powerful wave of magyck in a 600 AoE around himself, dealing 100/150/200/250/300 damage, and teleporting all enemies to a random spot in a 600/700/800/900/1000 AoE.

Elite: Vessel - AoE Massive Damage
Vessel.
I am the Vessel of all things magyck.
I control all things that move, and phase.
And if I do not take this responsibility, I wonder what will happen to all things living.

- The Watcher channels for 2 seconds, then he will summon a powerful Portal around himself in a 600/700/800 AoE, instantly teleporting all enemies in it to the sky, making them fall, dealing 200/250/300 damage, then teleporting all the units instantly next to the Watcher, dealing 50/100/150 bonus damage.

Utimate: Transversal - Targeted Enchantment
During the years, I have been trying to get into the Valley of Spirits.
I yet to do this, but I have gain some great things in return.
The State of Purity, a very beautiful, and dangerous place, trust me, I made it.

- The Watcher sets a enchantment on a targeted unit, and after 12 seconds, that unit will be teleported to a different State for 4/5/6 seconds, and when they return, 30/40/50% of their current HP will instantly be destroyed, and if this unit is sent to this State with only 10/15/20% of their max life, they will instantly be killed, and their respawn timer will be increased by 2/3/4 seconds.
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Comments:
...
Last edited by Dark_Humor on Thu Mar 05, 2009 7:39 pm, edited 51 times in total.
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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist

Post by Intoxicated Crayon » Thu Feb 19, 2009 10:32 pm

I'm going to use my smarticle abilities to make a hero review?! This is unheard of!

I liked the format of the story although it conflicts with the story. I believe someone on the bane is keeping the rift open and not some strange entity with extreme knowledge power... I mean, why would he want to keep the portal open if he could just close it? x x

First Skill; A complete copy of Dahaka's Teleport with an AoE slow. I don't know if you knew about the skill or not... meh.

Second Skill; The exact image of the first skill... It's AoE now and it can deal extra to banished units? Like wow! It's utterly useless without his third skill and has no use since this guy has no damaging skills and NO WAY to teleport anything till his elite and ultimate skills.

Third Skill; Interesting but it's being used in a bad fashion. It could have a lot of synergy with allies magick abilities but barely does anything for himself except extra damage for an AoE spell.

Elite Skill; It doesn't tell us if both allies and enemies are teleported. We also don't know where they'll go. Can be manipulated very well if the portal teleports everyone to the hero which can work great with the first skill but at the moment, it's useless and damages allies/enemies with no style at all. Whoops a portal, whoops stun or damage and I don't even know where I go?

Ultimate Skill; The ultimate isn't really support if it hurts allies. If your trying to save an ally with this, the damage from 'going to another place in the black hole' will kill them. You need to tell us where they go after entering these portals. Currently, he teleports himself and teleports allies/enemies while damaging them?
Not a good hero overall. It's not like I make good heroes myself but I've been told flaws in mine enough to tell you your own.

Lot's of potential and should probably stay away from these random effects like slow that doesn't even synergize. Black holes don't slow stuff... They sucks stuff in no matter how hard they try, nothing in the universe can escape it. I'd recommend you'd just say it's a portal to some limbo between the void and anti void or some area unless. Since it's a black hole, I don't think units that go in will come out, will they?

As I mentioned in the review, you could have made the elite skill teleport units to your location as long as you're within X of the portal so you could blink and trick a hero into it so he could teleport next to you in your own base! This could also work with allies to save them or perform assaults! There is a great thing working with these 2 skills in my opinion and if you mix in those slow effects you want and get a better ultimate and passive, this could be pretty awesome.

At the moment, it's just another hero with slow, slow, passive banish, teleport somewhere, and teleport somewhere.


Crayonz! Hope I seemed ok. Good luck with future heroes!
English should not be a prerequisite for intelligence,

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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist

Post by Dark_Humor » Thu Feb 19, 2009 10:43 pm

The second spell, by banish, I meant it banishes the units in the area, but it also leaves behind a rift, slowing other units who didn't get banished. And thanks for the reveiw. I will take your tips and use them if I happen to make another hero.
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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist

Post by Intoxicated Crayon » Thu Feb 19, 2009 10:50 pm

Oh I see. That makes more sense but then it almost cancels out the usefulness of the passive. The passive was supposedly for banishing stuff for the second skill and now it can only slow stuff and increase the magickal damage towards units who decide to attack you. Probably useful for making Gankers and such banished.

I can expect a few 'IMBAs' and 'WTF HAX' because of that passive. lol, Well, good luck once again.
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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by Dark_Humor » Thu Feb 19, 2009 11:06 pm

I remade the hero, to be more, teleport-y like, and more of a better banish-y type. :)
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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by TheDeathstalker » Thu Feb 19, 2009 11:41 pm

Ok, well, first of all, welcome to the fourms, and specifically to the hero suggestions. Now that that's out of the way, on to the hero!

First thought is that the base concept of this hero is cool, and has potential. The manipulation of space can have a lot of fun applications. That being said, there's a whole lot more innovation and creativity that can be put into this than there is right now.

The skills all seem mildly functional, but there's no genius to it, the skills just, do. For example, there is no reason for the random (and seemingly pretty meh) heals/damages slapped onto these skills. If you want a skill to be damaging, make it so, but don't just tack on damage to skills that don't need it. Before you do much more with this hero, stop and determine what you want him to do. Decide his role, his style, and his feel, and then take a good amount of time to find a way to demonstrate that. Be sure to build skills that work well with each other in interesting and subtle ways, not to mention being interesting and fun to use. If you need help with these things, feel free to ask around.

Also, a few things that are important for AotZ, all heroes start with the first 3 skills, the ultimates are meant to be ULTIMATE, and are charged by mana, which very few, if any other skills will use.
And though you come out of each gruelling bout,
All broken and beaten and scarred,
Just have one more try—it’s dead easy to die,
It’s the keeping-on-living that’s hard.

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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by Dark_Humor » Thu Feb 19, 2009 11:52 pm

Thanks for the feedback. I remade some of the heroes spells, this time, no slap heal or damage, instead, more, more supporter like. Replaced Teleportational Rift (Single Unit Teleport to Self) to Gateway (Channeled Teleport to Targeted Area). Replaced Gate of Judgement with Construct of World, which is like my old utimate, A Door to Victory, but instead teleports any explored area on the map, including allies in a AoE around The Grand Temneinist, and it instantly kills all non-hero enemy units who are banished in a 500 AoE in the targeted area. Also makes The Grand Temneinist, and the teleported allies invulnerable for a very short time, aswell as makes all enemies who are NOT banished in the targeted area, banished for a quite a long time, well, in my opinion. So, any suggestions. :)
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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by storyteller912510 » Fri Feb 20, 2009 9:29 pm

Hello! I'm new here as well... :o

Interesting hero. There's one or two things I have against it though.

The elite is a random skill steal. It doesn't fit in with the rest of the character, and doesn't really add anything to him, either.

I don't know how important normal attacks are in aotz, but from the only AoS I have experience with, normal attacks are pretty important, and at maxed lvl, it seems as if absolute matter will practically forbid most normal attacks directed at Devaue. (I'm also going to assume that he's either a ranged or a melee hero, since your ability makes the banished units immune to physical attacks, and you imply you can only attack banished units after you gain the skill.)

also, is the Gateway going to be used by creeps? Will creeps actively move toward the warps? otherwise it'll only be usable by heroes, right?

Well, that's pretty much it from me. Hope I'm of help, but since I've never played the game, my opinions might be meaningless.

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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by Dark_Humor » Fri Feb 20, 2009 10:24 pm

The hero is ranged, and yes, I know the skill steal does not fit, but I couldn't think of anything else... Oh yea, and "Abosolute Matter" lets him deal magical damage when attacking banished units I guess... After I post this, I will think of a good Elite, and change the wording in Abosolute Matter. Also, the Gateway will "taunt" both allied and enemy creeps, so that it won't be useless. Anyways, thanks for the feedback! :)

[[EDIT:]] Changed "Insert Here" to "Mass Matter," which allows a target allied hero, or The Grand Temneinist himself, to deal bonus damage on the next attack, and to banish the attacked unit also.

[[EDIT2:]] Instead of letting The Grand Temneinist the ability to attack banished units, I made it so that, when The Grand Temneinist banishes a unit, it also deal damage to the targeted enemy when that enemy reapears from being banished.
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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by TheDeathstalker » Sat Feb 21, 2009 3:20 am

Ok, I think I was a bit too vague in my previous post. This hero suffers from problems in several key areas, allow me to explain...

Focus:
The hero right now is built around two concepts, teleport based mobility and banishing. The only problem, is every skill approaches them from a different direction, and they never really converge at any point. While this hero doesn't suffer from forced synergy, it also doesn't benefit in any way from any synergy. This problem is the result of having five individual skills that you have cobbled together, instead of one central idea which is being expressed through five unique skills.

Style:
Look at other AotZ heroes, Hollow in particular. Looking at the hero you have here, nobody is going to get shivers from how cool this hero is, or how cool he does his job. This aspect of a hero is something that stems from two sources: The original idea and the interplay and ingenuity of the skills. Yes, you can have ingenious skills and have no real feel to the hero, but the idea is that ingeniously cool skills just stay in your mind and reinforce who and what the hero is as a whole.

Technical Aspects:
This is where the biggest of the problems lie, and while it's not expected that a first time hero maker is aware of all of these things, it is important to stress how important it is to stop and really, really think about every skill the hero has and how they play in with each other. I'm going to do my best to outline what these problems are, but be well aware, I'm sure I've missed something...

Take care with channeling skills: When you make a channeled spell, the biggest thing to realize is that for the duration of the channel, the hero can do absolutely nothing. This means the channels need to be purposeful, useful, and have a reasonable duration. In addition, you have to make the channeling spells useful not just by themselves, but somehow give them all some sort of play with your other skills. Take Countess Aurea for example, she has one channeling spell that slows all units in an area and does more damage to knocked down units, and another that after 2 seconds deals damage in an area and knocks down. The play between these is key, as you have to time both properly to get the full effect. Meanwhile your channel doesn't seem to benefit from any other of your spells other than damaging banished enemy units who willingly enter the gate. Keep this in mind. If I had to recommend something for that skill, I'd say it would be best to make it not channeling, but to somehow use it to create a gate-chain that works to improve the mobility of your entire team, and have levels increase the duration (or something) of the gates. Possibly have them be ward type things that are invisible X seconds after they are placed, so that allies can use them, but enemies won't know they're there. I'm sure you can think of things from there.
Succinct Skills: Nobody wants to read three lines to get the meaning of each and every skill you have, so for the sake of all of us, keep it simple. State Of Nothing is very simple, Banishes all enemy units in an AoE for X seconds and steals Y health from each. Look to other (preferrably DoE) hero suggestions to see how to do this.
Careful with your passive: Think about your hero, is he really going to be attacked often enough for that to come into play often? Also, is it even loosely fair? At level five, that means any hero trying to kill you has to do so in approximately three hits, lest they have to chase you (while slowed!) for the next 2.5 seconds before they can swing three more times only to fail, etc... While the idea is cool, I don't think it's quite right.
Skills can do faaaar more than just damage: If the only thing your teleporting banishing hero is doing is dealing direct damage, I think you've by far missed the point. Look at your Elite, not only is it counter productive for most people (melee hit deals more damage, but then can't do so again for the next 2 seconds), but it is just damage, that's it. There's nothing astoundingly cool that it does, it's just straight functional, and that's it.
Ultimate: Mass Teleport... really?: I mean, comon, look at Hollow (and Aethum), the ultimates we've seen thus far for AotZ are batshit crazy, and yet you're giving us a second and a half of invulnerability and a global teleport, which, unless it's been removed, is already on an item. Can this skill win you the game? Sure, steal a dragon, golem, and bigass spawn from one lane, drag it to the other, and let the pain fly, but will it feel epic while doing so? Not really... or at the very least, it would need some more incentive to really, really be worth it. Especially since nobody will ever be banished unless you're already there, so there's no real reason to have it kill all banished units.

After thinking so long on that hero, I'm honestly tempted to try making a skillset for him myself, but I'll save that for later...
And though you come out of each gruelling bout,
All broken and beaten and scarred,
Just have one more try—it’s dead easy to die,
It’s the keeping-on-living that’s hard.

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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by Rising_Dusk » Sat Feb 21, 2009 11:15 am

What is a Temneinist? And if I don't know what it is offhand, how do you expect anyone on BNet to figure it out? :p
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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by Dark_Humor » Sat Feb 21, 2009 12:37 pm

It means to cut in or out, like the rifts he makes, he cuts the space to go threw, then when he is at the right point, he cuts out to go back to the visible world, oh, and TheDeathStalker, thanks for your comment, I will try and make my hero like what you said. Thanks for the feedback!
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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by TheDeathstalker » Sun Feb 22, 2009 7:29 pm

A few quick thoughts:

1) Of the first three skills, you only have one that is actually used in combat, which isn't all too exciting, just a thought
2) Cut gains nothing from going from level 1->2, 2->3, or 4->5?
3) The passive would be nice if this hero seemed to have a large mana sink, but he doesn't seem to
4) Don't play the "Somehow X happens" card, if you can't think of a reason, skip it.
5) The elite actually becomes somewhat less useful as you level it, or at least it's usefulness isn't constant. I can think of times when it would be best to do it after 10 seconds, and some where it would be best for 2, but I don't think 2 is better than 10 by any stretch.
6) Try something more badass for the ult, really shoot for the moon.

And now, I'm gonna try a set of skills, just for the hell of it...

Basic Skill:
Nexus
  • Ward Summoning
    Creates a ward at the caster's location and at the target point which become invisible after X seconds and are magic immune. Allied units can Teleport from one to the other. Has a duration of Y (long) seconds. If cast upon another Nexus Ward, it will only create one ward at the caster's location, chaining the points together and extending the duration of the wards by Z.
Basic Skill:
Shoot for the Moon
  • AoE Channel
    Channels for X seconds, after which all enemy units within the AoE are teleported high into the sky. They fall back to earth Y seconds later and take Z damage.
Basic Skill:
Unraveling Seams
  • Active
    Fires a bolt of energy in target direction, dealing X damage to the first enemy it strikes and causes all enemies within Y AoE to move Z% slower and take reduced physical and increased magickal damage for W seconds.
Elite:
Eyes of Eternity
  • Passive
    The range of <Hero's> skills and attacks increases by X. Additionally their range can take advantage of Nexus Wards.
Ultimate:
Shattered Sky
  • Long Ass AoE Channel
    Channels for X(Long) seconds with clear visible effects. At the end of the channel, the targeted area is shattered, having had millions of micro-rifts created scrambling space and time in the area. The area now permanently causes the following effects:
    **Units and structures randomly blink to another location within the area every Y seconds, taking Z damage if they happen to blink into another unit/structure.
    **Units within the area move and attack W% slower.
    **All ranged attacks in the area attack the location of the unit, not the unit itself (essentailly, they're all inaccurate now).
He's a little rough around the edges, but he feels like he could very well be a shitton of fun...
And though you come out of each gruelling bout,
All broken and beaten and scarred,
Just have one more try—it’s dead easy to die,
It’s the keeping-on-living that’s hard.

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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by Dark_Humor » Sun Feb 22, 2009 10:32 pm

I changed... EVERYTHING about this hero. Now he has more of a icy feeling... AND still keeps his matter-y feeling, if you just add special effects and shit like that when he casts spells. And ALL his spells are damage... Which is not what I wanted, but what ever! And just to fill in some plot holes, this hero is all about space and matter, yes, but he "changes" to fit with the terrain he is in, just like Jhita... And I pwn with Jhita, but on another subject, this hero has no passives, so you WILL be wasting alot of mana, but I see this hero starting out with low health, but not as low as Scamp, and having a HOLY SHIT TON of mana. But I feel like his utimate is to much like AK, meh, I still like the utimate, and this time, IT CAN AFFECT HEROES. Now comment on how horrible this hero is. :)
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Re: Devanue Di'axa, the Grand Temneinist [Remade]

Post by TheDeathstalker » Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:37 pm

Did you keep an old copy of this hero around? I think you're probably better off undoing these changes, as there really is nothing worth looking at here... The skills do damage, and only damage, in very tired and uninteresting ways... You have 3 channels (one is spike target damage, one is blizzard with slow, and the other... is just random), immolation (like, exactly too...) and a slow + damage...

Stop for a second and breath. Now do it again. Repeat for about half an hour til the sugar rush that created this thing is done. Now that we're out of the DotA zone, really, really think about this hero, and see if there's anything meaningful to it. You done? Yeah, I couldn't find anything either. There's nothing wrong with a hero that just does damage (take Rikter for example), but you have to do it well, otherwise it's just shit. Oh, and you've completely lost the feel of the hero here, if you wanted to remake the hero that bad in such a completely different direction, you could have made a new thread...

Btw, any thoughts on my ideas?
Skill Sugguestions

TheDeathstalker wrote: Basic Skill:
Nexus

Ward Summoning
Creates a ward at the caster's location and at the target point which become invisible after X seconds and are magic immune. Allied units can Teleport from one to the other. Has a duration of Y (long) seconds. If cast upon another Nexus Ward, it will only create one ward at the caster's location, chaining the points together and extending the duration of the wards by Z.

Basic Skill:
Shoot for the Moon

AoE Channel
Channels for X seconds, after which all enemy units within the AoE are teleported high into the sky. They fall back to earth Y seconds later and take Z damage.

Basic Skill:
Unraveling Seams

Active
Fires a bolt of energy in target direction, dealing X damage to the first enemy it strikes and causes all enemies within Y AoE to move Z% slower and take reduced physical and increased magickal damage for W seconds.

Elite:
Eyes of Eternity

Passive
The range of <Hero's> skills and attacks increases by X. Additionally their range can take advantage of Nexus Wards.

Ultimate:
Shattered Sky

Long Ass AoE Channel
Channels for X(Long) seconds with clear visible effects. At the end of the channel, the targeted area is shattered, having had millions of micro-rifts created scrambling space and time in the area. The area now permanently causes the following effects:
**Units and structures randomly blink to another location within the area every Y seconds, taking Z damage if they happen to blink into another unit/structure.
**Units within the area move and attack W% slower.
**All ranged attacks in the area attack the location of the unit, not the unit itself (essentailly, they're all inaccurate now).
And though you come out of each gruelling bout,
All broken and beaten and scarred,
Just have one more try—it’s dead easy to die,
It’s the keeping-on-living that’s hard.

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