Loa, Anima Corruptio

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pandamanar
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Loa, Anima Corruptio

Post by pandamanar » Sat Sep 12, 2009 9:05 pm

Loa
Anima Corruptio
Agility | The Bane
Succubus or Siren model
Physical Ranged Attack

Level 1 Skill:
Mojo
  • Unit Target
    Places buff on this target that lasts X seconds. When a condition ends or is removed from this unit they
    [if the target is an ally] are healed for X% of the conditions duration.
    [if the target is an enemy] takes X% of the conditions duration in magickal damage
    Moderate Cooldown & Mana Cost
Level 1 Skill:
Pins And Needles
  • Line of Effect
    All units in this line are ruined and have a debuff applied to them that extends maim for X seconds every time they receive physical damage. This debuff lasts X seconds.
    Moderate Cooldown & Mana Cost
Level 1 Skill:
Phantom Pain
  • Point Target
    Summons a immobile spirit that has a ranged physical attack and extends bleed for X seconds on attack.
    Low Cooldown & Mana Cost
Level 6 Ultimate:
Possession
  • Unit Target
    Causes this unit to grow in size by X% (just a cosmetic to go along with the special effect to emphasize this unit's strength) and gives them a buff that increases their attack speed by X% and deals X physical damage per second. This buff lasts X seconds and has X stacks (or level) and each time this unit suffers from a condition the buff loses a stack and decreases in potency.
    Moderate Cooldown & High Mana Cost
Last edited by pandamanar on Thu Sep 17, 2009 8:41 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptela

Post by pandamanar » Tue Sep 15, 2009 6:22 pm

[Update] It appears that the sudden traffic increase due to the contest immediately subsided once all of the threads were locked... ;( I just really hope this Hero doesn't die without being criticized. If you've read this and not left a reply because you hate it, how do you expect me to know that you hated it so that I can improve upon it? I'm waiting for the results of the contest as much as the next guy, but instead of just waiting, why don't we spend some time on the other hero suggestions in our spare time?
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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptela

Post by TheDeathstalker » Wed Sep 16, 2009 6:52 am

Huh, what? Want a review do you? Alright, here goes....

Taking it from the top, we have Mojo, a buff that heals allies when they lose conditions or hurts enemies when they do the same. This could be brilliantly fun if integrated well. That being said, it's not. You've got other skills that apply conditions, sure, but they don't in any sort of spammy or fast way, and as such, you don't have enemies gaining or losing conditions very often, and at the same time, unless you've got Vic with ya, there's no way to plan to lose conditions off allies, and he already heals allies and actively removes conditions.

To be short, if you're gonna use this type of skill, the entire rest of the hero would need to be a large departure from what it is.

Pins and Needles is alright, I guess, but the only problem is it doesn't do much. Sure, maim's good, but look at Malth, he's got an AoE Maim that lasts a good while, doesn't require them to be hit, AND deals magick damage. This just... falls short. Now, if it were to say Ruin them, then cause any physical damage to further maim them, that'd be alright, as the Ruin gives incentive to physically attack, etc. That, and ruin isn't very common in the map as it is, so it'd be a nice addition.

Phantom Pain seems odd, honestly. The physical attack seems atypical for a spirit, first off, but I know that's for synergy, but whatever. Other than that, this skill does very little for the hero other than act as a mild catalyst for Pins and Mojo, but again, for it to be of any use for Mojo, it'd need to attack slower than it bleeds, which kinda makes the bleed in and of itself suck...

Posession is just... I dunno, massively buffing a unit that you can't have any control over (as I assume you exclude heroes, otherwise, Good God man, you've just made Anick more terrifying). Actually, on that point, that's probably why this skill fails to impress much, it's just an overconvoluted version of SotN, and that's not very interesting...

Overall, I'd say the hero just lacks any sort of focus, and as such, it's really hard to give advice as to what to do with it, as I can't see what you meant for it to do in the first place.........

Yeah, that's about it, gl.
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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptela

Post by Oxygen » Wed Sep 16, 2009 3:53 pm

Just for future reference, adding (or in your case, literally crushing) A's at the end of words doesn't always make it sound latin. Or cool. Especially the latter. I really hate the word you made up. It makes my brain itch. It screams "alright, corrupted, but that's not cool enough, let's make it latin! Let's not do any research and just slap in letters and try to make it sound latin! Corruptela!"

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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptela

Post by pandamanar » Wed Sep 16, 2009 4:25 pm

Oxygen wrote:Just for future reference, adding (or in your case, literally crushing) A's at the end of words doesn't always make it sound latin. Or cool. Especially the latter. I really hate the word you made up. It makes my brain itch. It screams "alright, corrupted, but that's not cool enough, let's make it latin! Let's not do any research and just slap in letters and try to make it sound latin! Corruptela!"
Woah woah woah... Come on Oxy. I googled "latin dictionary", typed in corruption and got that. This wasn't because I think latin makes me cool... exactly the opposite, I find it funny that Dusk's maps have so much latin in them. I actually deleted a small comment discussing the name, saying that I obviously didn't put any time into it and I just wanted to put the idea of a corrupted "Anima" on the table. If I didn't think I'd get bashed for it, I wouldn't even put names in my hero suggestions, because they only distract people from the skill set.
you don't have enemies gaining or losing conditions very often
mmm...
All units in this line have a debuff applies maim for X seconds every time they receive physical damage.
applies a condition every time they receive physical damage... that's a lot of the time if you combo-it with multiple summons and possession, not to mention the entire army that is backing you up or the team of heroes who generally have SOME sort of physical damage output.
they don't in any sort of spammy or fast way
Phantom Pain purposely has a low cooldown and mana cost so that you can spam it and each of their attacks apply bleed.
it'd need to attack slower than it bleeds
Maybe it does. I never specified their attack speed (although I'd hope it to be faster than a snail...) and I used X for their bleed duration... so....

On the subject of Possession, I was planning on it to target all non-structure units, Heroes included. I do agree that it looks like SotN, but I think it would accomplish different things. SoTN's scaling effect causes players to run and hide, where as this skill's scaling effect is meant to tell enemies to focus their fire on him, since his buff is removed with every condition that is applied to him/her/it. I understand your criticism about the skill's lack of a role, but I really planned her like that... Each of her skills is universally useful, while also working well with each other. I really appreciate your review, thanks.
Last edited by pandamanar on Wed Sep 16, 2009 4:42 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptela

Post by Rising_Dusk » Wed Sep 16, 2009 4:29 pm

To be perfectly fair, the only of the animae to actually have proper Latin names are Innert and Stille. Innert's is even mispelled in DoE by accident. (It should be Immobilis) Parhelios' title doesn't make sense as the proper latin would be "Annihilo." A closer form for the common Animae theme would be "Annihilatus." I used Annihilus as a sort of mix of the two to create a more unique name. (Shortly after his character being named, Annihilus was used as a charm in Diablo 2 and I discovered that Annihilus is a villain in the Marvel universe. Woops.)

I feel as though I might fix it in 1.14 just for continuity.

By the way, proper Latin for this guy's name would be corruptio.
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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptela

Post by TheDeathstalker » Wed Sep 16, 2009 6:51 pm

pandamanar wrote:
you don't have enemies gaining or losing conditions very often
mmm...
All units in this line have a debuff applies maim for X seconds every time they receive physical damage.
applies a condition every time they receive physical damage... that's a lot of the time if you combo-it with multiple summons and possession, not to mention the entire army that is backing you up or the team of heroes who generally have SOME sort of physical damage output.
they don't in any sort of spammy or fast way
Phantom Pain purposely has a low cooldown and mana cost so that you can spam it and each of their attacks apply bleed.
it'd need to attack slower than it bleeds
Maybe it does. I never specified their attack speed (although I'd hope it to be faster than a snail...) and I used X for their bleed duration... so....
Ugh. A couple things here. First of all, Mojo doesn't do jack shit for conditions applied, so you get a grand single triggering of it off of Pins and Needles, as it doesn't even sound remotely like you meant X (which, btw, quick rundown of basic math, X=X, generally speaking, so if you want to mean different things within a single skill, try using different variables, as it's really confusing otherwise) to be of the order of a third of a second or something... which is the only way Mojo works in conjunction with it. Do-de-do... what else did you mess up... oh, right, again looking to the duration of conditions, if you have a spammy spell that summons things that apply conditions, what the hell makes you think the durations would ever expire before the target that's Mojo'ed would be hit again by another, as you said, spammed attack from the summons? We again run into the same problem of a hero that just fails at having an effective skill, as the durations on these conditions would have to be so ridiculously low as to have them be utterly useless except for in conjunction with Mojo.

And don't get me started on your ripoff of SotN again, it's just... uninspired? The whole skill seems as if it'd be 1/2 utterly useless and 1/2 ungodly cheap, with no middle ground, and most importantly, no real skill involved.

By the by, I would really hold back on calling all the skills "universally useful while also working well with each other", because, it really does seem to me that for there to be ANY synergy within this hero, the skills would have to be useless without Mojo, and that's just no fun.

Sorry to be harsh about this, but it really didn't seem like you received any of the criticism I gave, but instead went "let's see how this is wrong", and rushed into saying it was, without considering the points raised. And if it was intentional to have the hero walk the line between not working and really not working, then I really do think there needs to be some marked improvement before any criticism can be shrugged off. There are times when it is right to debate the points of a hero, and there are times to use that nice, flat part of your hand called the palm for it's intended purpose, hitting your forehead. [Also: Never bump your hero begging for feedback unless it's fallen at least a little from the top post, it's just... not best.]
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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptio

Post by Intoxicated Crayon » Wed Sep 16, 2009 10:58 pm

To sum it all up, the hero is based off Mojo as if it's an innate and the entire hero feels like a mess. Corruption has absolutely nothing to do with the hero and Loa reminds of me a volcano, KK.

Well. I can't really add onto what others said. I planned on posting earlier, but it looks like most of us saw the same flaws, so...

I'd recommending remaking the hero since Mojo is what drives the hero forward. Every skill needs to be useful at all times. It can never be a waste accidently putting a point into one skill. If all the skills of a hero are fail and are only good in conjuction with one another, it's crap and the hero must remade but... that's my opinion of course.

I completely agree with Death, it seems like no changes were made as if the hero is perfect and cannot be changed. Death's is definitely right about Possession, it's a worthless and watered down SotN that renders you extremely vulnerable. Sacrificing all control over yourself seems pathetic especially since the hero is so active with 3 click and target skills.


Also, in my honest opinion, Loa is an unfitting name. Whenever I read it, I think of a volcano. This hero has nothing to do with volcanoes. Although, some people might not make the connection but I guess it's just me since I see Vertejaune as Green-Yellow and Caliga as a pair of magick sandals. GL anyways, no need in repeating any more that's been said more than once.

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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptio

Post by pandamanar » Wed Sep 16, 2009 11:24 pm

Do-de-do... what else did you mess up... oh, right
I know I must irritate you quite a bit, but this kind of shit isn't necessary.
Sorry to be harsh about this
Then don't be.
I don't need to debate with you as to whether or not I read and understood your criticisms, but I am willing to say that I understand the points you are making now. For my other skills to work with Mojo they would have to have such small condition durations that they would be useless by themselves. To solve this problem I could either
  • - change Mojo so that it procs' when the condition is added instead of when it ends
    - change Mojo so that it deals X% of the conditions duration in damage, and make some of the condition skills extend instead of apply
[Also: Never bump your hero begging for feedback unless it's fallen at least a little from the top post, it's just... not best.]
Not best for what? I can agree that I've been a bit impatient due to my need to procrastinate on more important things with hero-crafting, but I'd rather have you insult me than tell me to follow some unspoken law on an internet forum.

@Crayon
Corruption has absolutely nothing to do with the hero
eh?
Loa reminds of me a volcano
I googled voodoo to look up some names or some ideas and Loa came up as the name for some kind of spirit. It seemed appropriate, but that is beside the point since writing names and having lore for hero suggestions are just fluff that shouldn't effect your critic of the skill set.
watered down SotN that renders you extremely vulnerable
My idea was that it could either encourage your allies to focus on a certain target while Mojo ticked them down, or have enemies focus on you while Mojo healed you. Due to my misunderstanding of how conditions end (they apparently don't end when another of the same kind is added), none of my planned synergy works.

Oh and after sounding like a biscuit, I'd like to say I appreciate the fact that you've all responded.
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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptio

Post by Intoxicated Crayon » Thu Sep 17, 2009 12:16 am

[a$$] Loa if I'm correct is Mauna Loa, the goddess of volcanoes. But... I know for a fact that a volcano in Hawaii is named Mauna Loa and it's a common vacation spot for skiing by the beach.

Corruptio. Corruption. There is no corruption. Note how Parhelios annihilates(annihilus) people and Innert used to and is somewhat related to movement(Immobilus/ Immobility). See what I'm getting at?


OM NOM NOM, LET'S BE MOAR MEAN. Another thing, Mojo weakens possession if you ask me. The buff weakens if you gain/lose a condition Oo. So you get healed but weaker? NIOCE!

Anyways... NP the for the comment! [/a$$]
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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptio

Post by pandamanar » Thu Sep 17, 2009 8:37 am

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loa
Also, the reason I called her corruption because I thought it would be interesting if one of the Animae had been corrupted, although my skills might not mirror that.
You are correct, Possession does weaken you when you gain a condition, but I did that on purpose to give your enemies an incentive to focus on the mojo'd target. If someone is mojo'd, most people will just not inflict conditions on them to nullify Mojos effect. Combining Possession with Mojo makes you too powerful to ignore.

Also @ Death : Would you rather I use Potato instead of X? Really, any place-holder will do.
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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptio

Post by Rising_Dusk » Thu Sep 17, 2009 9:34 am

pandamanar wrote:Also @ Death : Would you rather I use Potato instead of X?
Yes, because it will solve world hunger that way.
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Re: Loa, Anima Corruptio

Post by Loki » Thu Sep 17, 2009 4:20 pm

Let's do what comes naturally
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