Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

This is where all random discussion about DoE goes. If it doesn't feel like it fits anywhere else but is still related to the map, this is the place to post it.
Post Reply
User avatar
Oxygen
Grandmaster of Grammar
Posts: 1281
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2008 6:14 pm

Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Oxygen » Mon Apr 07, 2008 5:49 pm

Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Quite recently, I've wanted to play a 1v1 DoE match with one of my friend. So anyways, quickly did we get into the game, and quickly did we realize that not only were we both overwhelmed by an insane ammount of starting gold, as well as a huge income, but also did we quickly realize the overpower of creep massing / distracting etc. Anyways, I lost the match due to my inability to defend both outposts at once, a common problem I have when playing against King's pubbiesmash games, to which I gladly participate and offer myself as a little and insignificant challenge. But let's get back to the discussion at hand.

What's my point here? What am I trying to introduce?

There should be a minimum of options, outside fast games & all random. Perhaps, the inability to purchase creep spawns & builders, (-nomercenaries), ability to shutdown a few lane at the start of the game when the ammount of player is under 4 (-shut 1,2,3,4), the ability to rebalance a game when the ammount of player is not balanced ( instead of completely remaking it, I find it so annoying! ) (-rebalance), no malteron, fahren or skittel (-noimba) etc.

See where I'm going with this? I'd love to be able to do 1v1, 2v2 or 3v3 matches. But the game doesn't really allow that, as of right now.

TheIrishPatriot
Grandmaster of Grammar
Posts: 1001
Joined: Tue Jan 15, 2008 8:01 am
Location: Not Sweden
Contact:

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by TheIrishPatriot » Mon Apr 07, 2008 6:50 pm

I love the 1v1s, because the other person never knows to spam creeps :D.
Image
Read my prose please :).
An tírghrá Éireannach

User avatar
Rising_Dusk
Chosen of the Intargweeb
Posts: 4031
Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 1:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Rising_Dusk » Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:00 pm

I will never add a rebalance option to the game. The game is by far not balanced to have heroes like Vela, Anick, Sozen, Janise, Genobee, and Arro Kree on the same team. In the same light, as a player I would leave a game if some retards typed "-rebalance" and now I was forced to repick a hero at the same level as the old one. That would infuriate me, screw that, I'd leave. I know a lot of other people feel the same way too.

I allow a full rematch because it evens the playing field totally. Some people don't get BSed out of their hero, some people don't get BSed out of their team, everything get's reset. It is the only way to do it, and if not by this method there would be no runtime rematch at all.
no malteron, fahren or skittel (-noimba)
That is all being adjusted for in 1.09. Either way, I refuse that command too.
Perhaps, the inability to purchase creep spawns & builders, (-nomercenaries), ability to shutdown a few lane at the start of the game when the ammount of player is under 4 (-shut 1,2,3,4)
So you're asking me to totally nullify the entire design paradigm of DoE so that you can have fewer things to think about in a game? Please, be joking, you of all people cannot be that naive.
"I'll come to Florida one day and make you look like a damn princess." ~Hep

User avatar
Fledermaus
Keeper of the Keys
Posts: 354
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:55 am
Location: New Zealand
Contact:

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Fledermaus » Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:07 pm

no malteron, fahren or skittel (-noimba)
So rather than have the heros balanced, you want Dusk to add a mode to remove them? Sounds good.

The only mode that I would like to see is Express Mode being swapped for Random Races, just for fun

User avatar
Rising_Dusk
Chosen of the Intargweeb
Posts: 4031
Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 1:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Rising_Dusk » Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:10 pm

This is not, and never will be, ToB.
"I'll come to Florida one day and make you look like a damn princess." ~Hep

User avatar
Oxygen
Grandmaster of Grammar
Posts: 1281
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2008 6:14 pm

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Oxygen » Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:06 pm

Rising_Dusk wrote:I will never add a rebalance option to the game. The game is by far not balanced to have heroes like Vela, Anick, Sozen, Janise, Genobee, and Arro Kree on the same team. In the same light, as a player I would leave a game if some retards typed "-rebalance" and now I was forced to repick a hero at the same level as the old one. That would infuriate me, screw that, I'd leave. I know a lot of other people feel the same way too.
The abuse of the rematch option frustrates me, though. I've seen it abused, really, and since everyone tends to be a damn sheep and do whatever everyone does, well, -rm, -rm, -rm,... comes in fast. I've been in a game where it was -rm'd 3 times just because everybody would follow some retard that kept doing it whenever there'd be a leaver ( 5v6 for instance, duh its still unfair ) or whatever-,... Needless to say that THIS made me leave.
Rising_Dusk wrote:
no malteron, fahren or skittel (-noimba)
That is all being adjusted for in 1.09. Either way, I refuse that command too.
That was a little joke of my own :3 sowwy!
Rising_Dusk wrote: So you're asking me to totally nullify the entire design paradigm of DoE so that you can have fewer things to think about in a game? Please, be joking, you of all people cannot be that naive.
I'm not asking for that. I'm saying that it's simply impossible to hold 4 lanes with a single hero, and I'm trying to find a solution to it. Reducing the game to two lane for 1v1, three lanes for 2v2 and four lanes for 3v3+ isn't such an insane idea. There'll still be room for ''sneak spawn attacks''. But then again, these wouldn't happen so randomly and so often if the gold gained wasn't 6 times the normal ammount. I guess THAT is what really screwed me, rather than the long distance flight a la defense
TheIrishPatriot wrote:I love the 1v1s, because the other person never knows to spam creeps :D.
Actually, it wasn't the game you think it was, pat. Yeah, the one where I messed around. Noes. The one where I simply couldn't handle it.

User avatar
Rising_Dusk
Chosen of the Intargweeb
Posts: 4031
Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2007 1:50 pm
Contact:

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Rising_Dusk » Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:42 pm

I've been in a game where it was -rm'd 3 times just because everybody would follow some retard that kept doing it whenever there'd be a leaver ( 5v6 for instance, duh its still unfair ) or whatever-,... Needless to say that THIS made me leave.
If I added a rebalance option, you'd end up with sheep typing "-rb" all of the time instead of "-rm". Hell, they might even type both and piss you off more. Please, if you're going to use an example at least have it pertain relevantly to the topic.
I'm saying that it's simply impossible to hold 4 lanes with a single hero
Of course it is, because your enemy is in an identical boat. You, as a good player, could just as easily hire a counterpush to stop their push. (Trust me, it works!) If they are pushing that lane and you are pushing another, you both slaughter respective lanes. So what's the big deal? Some of my greatest games are 2v2 and consist of me plotting with my ally the best way to catch the opponent off guard and lay waste to a base or a lane. That is the design paradigm of DoE that you cannot simply use a hero, you must use where the hero is and other external elements of the map to win. That is precisely what you are effectively asking me to remove with your suggestions.
"I'll come to Florida one day and make you look like a damn princess." ~Hep

User avatar
Oxygen
Grandmaster of Grammar
Posts: 1281
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2008 6:14 pm

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Oxygen » Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:03 pm

Rising_Dusk wrote:
I've been in a game where it was -rm'd 3 times just because everybody would follow some retard that kept doing it whenever there'd be a leaver ( 5v6 for instance, duh its still unfair ) or whatever-,... Needless to say that THIS made me leave.
If I added a rebalance option, you'd end up with sheep typing "-rb" all of the time instead of "-rm". Hell, they might even type both and piss you off more. Please, if you're going to use an example at least have it pertain relevantly to the topic.
Yeah, true, I must be the only person that doesn't mind rebalance. I'm too used to age of myths! I love getting on the losing side, because I can actually fight ususally better people. But obviously, I'm crazy like that. D:
Rising_Dusk wrote:
I'm saying that it's simply impossible to hold 4 lanes with a single hero
Of course it is, because your enemy is in an identical boat. You, as a good player, could just as easily hire a counterpush to stop their push. (Trust me, it works!) If they are pushing that lane and you are pushing another, you both slaughter respective lanes. So what's the big deal? Some of my greatest games are 2v2 and consist of me plotting with my ally the best way to catch the opponent off guard and lay waste to a base or a lane. That is the design paradigm of DoE that you cannot simply use a hero, you must use where the hero is and other external elements of the map to win. That is precisely what you are effectively asking me to remove with your suggestions.
Yes I get what you mean now. Doe isn't hero based entierely, yes yes. I guess the 1v1 environment somewhat made me feel so weird about the game.

How about a -wtfmode where every heroes get random spells? Genobee with crossfire, whirlwind, zuma roar and discharge would be awesome! Okay forget this, I'm getting crazy now I need some sleep.

Should keep this thread open though, some good ideas could come at some point

User avatar
Fledermaus
Keeper of the Keys
Posts: 354
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:55 am
Location: New Zealand
Contact:

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Fledermaus » Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:44 pm

Rising_Dusk wrote:This is not, and never will be, ToB.
But RR is so fun =/ and considering DoE actually has a decent number of heros, it would be even better.

User avatar
assassingao
Teh UBER Typist
Posts: 999
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 12:56 pm

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by assassingao » Mon Apr 07, 2008 11:02 pm

How about a -wtfmode where every heroes get random spells? Genobee with crossfire, whirlwind, zuma roar and discharge would be awesome! Okay forget this, I'm getting crazy now I need some sleep.

Replace that with "Random Races"


It'd be AWESOME OMFG!

Glyphe with Sunder....

User avatar
Fledermaus
Keeper of the Keys
Posts: 354
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:55 am
Location: New Zealand
Contact:

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Fledermaus » Mon Apr 07, 2008 11:22 pm

That'd do me. It's amazing how fun/funny that kinda of mode is.

polishgangsta
Holder of the Alt-F4
Posts: 109
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:11 am

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by polishgangsta » Tue Apr 08, 2008 12:01 am

how about "-imba". It could make you play DotA.
ImageImage ImageImageImageImageImage

snakehawk37
Holder of the Alt-F4
Posts: 105
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2008 1:48 pm

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by snakehawk37 » Tue Apr 08, 2008 12:03 am

If he puts in an RR, that will just fuel Cassiel's accusations of him copying ToB. This would be a very noticeable similarity oO

In addition, can you imagine vela + the order heros who require aim, which includes many of them.

User avatar
Fledermaus
Keeper of the Keys
Posts: 354
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:55 am
Location: New Zealand
Contact:

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Fledermaus » Tue Apr 08, 2008 12:09 am

RR shouldn't be a balanced game mode. It's just for getting funny/imba hero combos.

Rectifier
Revenent of the Replies
Posts: 259
Joined: Sun Mar 23, 2008 4:47 pm

Re: Polishing a few options, regulating the machine

Post by Rectifier » Tue Apr 08, 2008 3:14 am

This thread is getting derailed, talk about something that hasn't been completely refused by Dusk already.

Example of an idea: possible deny creep system.

Just think of something random that hasn't been considered yet and ask, stop rehashing the same issues again and again.

Post Reply

Return to “Updates & Discussion”